Author Topic: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop  (Read 1072 times)

Offline naresh

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Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« on: May 31, 2012, 09:06:59 PM »
I am a newbie in dealing with RAW images.

Can any one please through some light on
          1. Why to use RAW than JPEG?
          2. how to edit RAW files in Photoshop CS5



Thanks in advance ..... :)

Offline toofan

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2012, 06:20:09 AM »
RAW files store more information (about 30% more: what I recently read in this forum) and can be tweaked more in photo editing software. You could change the white balance and other things by default which you would have selected at the time of shooting.

RAW files can be edited same as jpegs were edited but there are some specific software to edit them more effectively.

Offline Image

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2012, 07:18:02 AM »
There are many resources on the web which explain nicely as to what RAW is and its advantages. RAW File captures what the sensor saw essentially. JPEG on the other hand is a derivative which has applied a lot of assumptions in an un-changeable way (for example White Balance).

Here is what Michael Reichmann of Luminous Landscape writes in This Link.

Reasons to Shoot Raw

— A raw file is comparable to the latent image contained in an exposed but undeveloped piece of film. It holds exactly what the imaging chip recorded. Nothing more. Nothing less. This means that the photographer is able to extract the maximum possible image quality, whether now or in the future. A good analogy with the traditional world of film is that you have the opportunity to use a different type of developer or development time at any point in the future if one comes along that you think might do a better job of processing the image.

— Raw files have not had while balance set. They are tagged with whatever the camera's setting was, (either that which was manually set or via auto-white-balance), but the actual data has not been changed. This allows one to set any colour temperature and white balance one wishes after the fact with no image degradation. It should be understood that once the file has been converted from the linear space and has had a gamma curve applied (such as in a JPG) white balance can no longer be properly done.

— File linearization and colour filter array (Bayer) conversion is done on a computer with a fast and powerful microprocessor. This allows much more sophisticated algorithms to be used than those done in a camera with its slower and less powerful processor and with less space for complex conversion programs.

— The raw file is tagged with contrast and saturation information as set in the camera by the user, but the actual image data has not been changed. The user is free to set these based on a per-image evaluation rather than use one or two generalized settings for all images taken.

— Possibly the biggest advantage of shooting raw is that one has a 16 bit image (post raw conversion) to work with. This means that the file has 65,536 levels to work with. This is opposed to a JPG file's 8 bit space with just 256 brightness levels available. This is important when editing an image, particularly if one is trying to open up shadows or alter brightness in any significant way.

Figures #1 and #2 below shows why. Assuming for this example a 5 stop dynamic range, you can see how much data is found in each of the brightness levels in the image. In other words with a 12 bit file the two darkest levels of the file combined have some 384 brightness levels to work with.

An 8 bit JPG file on the other hand has considerably less. Both the sRGB and Adobe RGB colour spaces use a gamma 2.2 encoding. Gamma encoding reallocates encoding levels from the upper f-stops into the lower f-stops to compensate for the human eye's greater sensitivity to absolute changes in the darker tone range. Therefore an 8 bit JPG file has just 47 brightness levels available in the bottom two stops. (The remaining levels out of 256 are for the f-stops beyond the 5 in this example).
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Offline Image

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2012, 07:25:18 AM »
Photoshop uses what is known as ACR or Adobe Camera Raw converter to massage the RAW files. You can download the most recent ACR from Adobe's website - check for compatibility with CS5 as CS6 is also out.

This is how ACR looks when opened in Photoshop.

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Offline thelightening

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2012, 10:32:32 AM »
Ram Sir, yes..u explained it brief and well... Naresh, lets sit together this weekend to explore more as we planned, fine?

Offline VikramF

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2012, 11:03:12 AM »
I am a newbie in dealing with RAW images.

Can any one please through some light on
          1. Why to use RAW than JPEG?
          2. how to edit RAW files in Photoshop CS5

Naresh,

You've got pretty much as detailed an answer as is possible on a forum from Image.

If you've got zero experience with RAW files, then you'll likely be fairly upset with the pics as they aren't processed at all (your jpegs are processed within the camera from 'raw' files - just that the camera won't store the RAW file if you've got it set for jpeg only) - even the pic you see in the LCD is actually a processed RAW file.

Here's a basic workflow around RAW files: http://www.pixelgenius.com/tips/schewe-cameraraw.pdf
Not sure what software you'd use - CS5 will open it in a newer version of ACR than you see in that pdf.
Yes, it's a long document (27 pages) and yet it's still a very small overview - there's only one way, to experiment, read, understand, experiment some more - no shortcuts around that.
This link (look at the table), should provide you with a basic 1,2,3 on how to develop your own workflow: http://www.ronbigelow.com/articles/workflow_basic/workflow_basic.htm
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Offline naresh

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2012, 10:17:19 PM »
Thanks Vimal, Image and Vikram for ur valueable explanations

I have successfully installed ACR in my cs5. I am some how managed to open my raw image in Camera raw.


I will read and execute the link send by vikram .... :)

Offline subhsen

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2012, 10:54:07 PM »
Well, as you WANTED it...

1. If you shoot in RAW, you don't rely on the camera's PP. That means, you depend on your own post-processing (PP) abilities. So, first point to answer, do you know PP better than what your camera knows? RAW files are similar to raw 'wheat' - where you must have a home grinder and you exactly know how to grind it to make the kind of 'atta' you want, kneading the dough, belao it, sheNking it, and serving it with butter/ghee or just as it. As opposed to a ready-made fulka (as in shooting in JPEG), with only an option left to you to add ghee or butter, or just eat sukha. I think you got the point.

2. Go through what Vikram linked. You'll get a more options in google/youtube. RAW is for creating signature style - means, looking at a photo of yours, people feel WANTED. If you don't want to take that trouble, leave it on your camera and be general.

Did this help you?

Regards...
« Last Edit: June 01, 2012, 10:57:31 PM by subhsen »
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Offline theqca

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2012, 10:01:31 AM »
@subhsen - that's a nice way of putting it :)

Offline ISO

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2012, 10:46:40 PM »
RAW files store more information (about 30% more:

I don't know frm where this 30% theory has come?

Does this means after converting (raw => Jpeg) jpeg look inferior (by 30%?)

Let's put it raw has more latitude for adjusting WB or exposure than Jpeg.

This doesn't mean it can't be done on jpeg but it will lossy.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2012, 10:48:50 PM by ISO »
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Offline Pallav

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2012, 10:21:04 PM »
Quote
1. If you shoot in RAW, you don't rely on the camera's PP. That means, you depend on your own post-processing (PP) abilities. So, first point to answer, do you know PP better than what your camera knows?

So i prefer to use RAW+JPEG and try to play with RAW images and do ****-bits with JPEG images and compare. We have alot of space to play with image in RAW as compare to JPEG.

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Offline subhsen

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #11 on: June 05, 2012, 10:41:13 PM »
@Pallav:

It's always better to try before you  buy (not in monetary term, but in acceptance term). Do it, if you shoot the number of images in a day, that fits into your card. Raw is not just about exposure (I exactly don't know what includes/excludes in exposure though). You can do lots of other things  (I'm not talking about percentage here) in RAW without being lossless. Since I've bought DSLRs, I've  hardly used JPEG (except in one occasion where I was jacked) for the kind of editing that's there in my workflow.

I do general 'overall' editing in RAW mode, and when I export (open) it in PS (which is more-or-less in JPEG), I just do local editing.

IMHO, for 'overall' editing, RAW is better than JPEG. It makes sense to shoot in RAW if you shoot in UNcontrolled (or, though less-preferred, even in controlled) situation when you can't afford to lose a moment and you are not forgiven for the errors you might make for not setting your camera right.

Test and try. Rest is all yours!
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Offline ISO

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2012, 09:40:49 AM »
@Pallav:

It's always better to try before you  buy (not in monetary term, but in acceptance term). Do it, if you shoot the number of images in a day, that fits into your card. Raw is not just about exposure (I exactly don't know what includes/excludes in exposure though). You can do lots of other things  (I'm not talking about percentage here) in RAW without being lossless. Since I've bought DSLRs, I've  hardly used JPEG (except in one occasion where I was jacked) for the kind of editing that's there in my workflow.

I do general 'overall' editing in RAW mode, and when I export (open) it in PS (which is more-or-less in JPEG), I just do local editing.

IMHO, for 'overall' editing, RAW is better than JPEG. It makes sense to shoot in RAW if you shoot in UNcontrolled (or, though less-preferred, even in controlled) situation when you can't afford to lose a moment and you are not forgiven for the errors you might make for not setting your camera right.

Test and try. Rest is all yours!

Well said subh da
« Last Edit: June 06, 2012, 09:43:27 AM by ISO »
Regards & best wishes

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Offline amit_hazari

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #13 on: June 17, 2012, 10:44:13 PM »
The following is a nice article related to question#1 of OP:
http://mansurovs.com/raw-vs-jpeg

Offline Juna

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2012, 03:47:14 PM »
Hi friends...

I have got some raw files with me and they are lying as it is coz I'am not able to open them up in lightroom 3. i learned that you have to use some other software to convert raw files so that they can be seen in lightroom.

I'm completely a layman in terms of raw. kindly make me understand in very simple terms (if possible with some screenshots) so that i can open raw files in lightroom 3.

Thanks in advance..!! CHEERS...!!
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Offline VikramF

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2012, 05:04:58 PM »
Hi friends...

I have got some raw files with me and they are lying as it is coz I'am not able to open them up in lightroom 3. i learned that you have to use some other software to convert raw files so that they can be seen in lightroom.

I'm completely a layman in terms of raw. kindly make me understand in very simple terms (if possible with some screenshots) so that i can open raw files in lightroom 3.

Thanks in advance..!! CHEERS...!!

Could you please provide links to these places where you've learned that you need to use some other software to convert RAW files so that they can be seen in lightroom?

Please update your LR. Follow same process as: http://blogs.adobe.com/crawlspace/2011/03/keeping-photoshop-up-to-date.html
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Offline Asgar

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #16 on: July 05, 2012, 05:18:48 PM »
Vikram bro, I have got latest version of lr (4.1) but when i import RAW file to lr i am not able to see preview, what can be the issue?  ::)
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Offline VikramF

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2012, 05:45:03 PM »
Vikram bro, I have got latest version of lr (4.1) but when i import RAW file to lr i am not able to see preview, what can be the issue?  ::)

Did you read the link above? I think not.  ::)

Sorry - not spoon-feeding you. The answer is clearly given there. It's not a version issue.

In the case of Juna - he's got a D5100 and LR3 - he just needs to update his Camera RAW to 6.4 (see, it's not the LR version we're talking about). If he can't get to CR6.4, then yes, he might need to open in another RAW processor, save as DNG and then open in LR3

You'll need Camera RAW 7.1 - the link above tells you how to get it.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2012, 05:53:36 PM by VikramF »
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Offline Juna

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Re: Help me to use RAW in photography & Photoshop
« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2012, 01:03:01 PM »
Thanx  lot Vikram.

Could you please provide links to these places where you've learned that you need to use some other software to convert RAW files so that they can be seen in lightroom?

It was my bad completely. I interpret those discussions in wrong way. Well now I'm going through the link at the moment. Will discuss once I have gone through that.
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